Casting director Jeanie Bacharach on what makes an audition work, how she watches self-tapes and Zoom callbacks, and the casting stories behind The Dropout, Station Eleven and Dying for Sex.
12 Things Actors Should Know About Auditioning for Jeanie Bacharach
Drawn from what is actually said on camera, so you can decide whether to
spend the 31:16 watching it.
Play the scene, and light and mic it well
Her first question watching any audition, in person or on tape, is whether she believes the words coming out of your mouth. Beyond good lighting and good sound, she does not care how you framed the tape. She wants to see you drop yourself into the character and make the words your own.
Small co-star roles are the hardest because there is nothing to dig into. Sending two takes with different choices is fine. The main thing is to stay present and not make too much out of a handful of lines.
Bacharach would rather see a bold wrong choice than a safe reading with no choices in it. But different for its own sake does not work either. You can stretch the role and come at it a new way, as long as you still play the reality of the scene and the relationship between the characters.
A callback means they liked it, so do not reinvent it
If you got called back, people responded to what you did. Trust it and do not change it all up. Ask questions, through your reps or directly, because the character often shifts during casting before the writing catches up, and scripts are being shared less and less.
Some writers want every word and every comma exactly as written. Others are open to improvising. That is research you should do and a question you can ask at the audition or callback, but come prepared for either answer.
Self-tapes widened the door and shortened attention
Tapes leveled the playing field, but she admits to what she calls a swipe left mentality: with so many tapes there is always someone else to look at. On a pre-screen for a small role there is no time for notes. Being in a room together lets her see you take an adjustment and trust you on a set.
For a Zoom callback, check with casting first, but if you can have your reader physically next to you, do it. Zoom lag kills comedy timing. A good reader gives you what the scene needs without drawing attention to themselves.
You cannot walk into a room with a bag of props, but on tape you can set yourself in the scene. Give yourself business to do and props if they help. If the character leaves, leave frame. Just do not let the production design outshine the work.
For chemistry reads, do all the usual prep and be specific, but do not be married to your reading. If you know the beats of the scene cold, you have a roadmap, so when your partner gives you something unexpected you can follow it and play the detour.
Jenny Slate pushed to get in the room for Dying for Sex and won it in a chemistry read. Reps often protect established actors from reading, but offers are rarer now. Bacharach says that if somebody will not read, producers move on to somebody who will.
She kept turning down Naveen Andrews for Sunny Balwani in The Dropout because she thought he was too good looking. His reps kept pushing, he came in and crushed it. Rachel Brosnahan was her first thought for Mrs. Maisel, which was a battle because Brosnahan had not done comedy.
Without representation it is hard to get seen, so do theater and student film so there is something to look at. She refuses to scout on TikTok and follower counts have not mattered on her projects. She cast Matilda Lawler in Station Eleven after watching her listen, fully alive, to a monologue she had heard for months.
first of all thank you so much for being here thank you for having me sharing your time with us and really I just want to start by going over some basics like actor casting director basics like laying the ground like your opinion what works for you so first of all I just want to ask you know are there things that you identify that just make a good audition I think that we were talking about this just before we came in but for me it's about playing the scene it's always going to come back to playing the scene and I'm less interested in how you've framed your audition other than good lighting and good sound please please please good loud good lighting good sound if you're self-taping but I just am interested in seeing you play the scene I want to see you bring yourself or some aspects of yourself to the character and make it you know come alive drop yourself in and connect to that character and make those words your own to me that's sort of usually the first kind of response I'll have watching an audition again whether it's in person or on tape is do I believe the words coming out of this person's mouth and then you know if it's if it's a small co-star role and there's not a lot of information are you looking for people to get you know to make a couple of different choices and should everybody send at least two takes if it's a small you know just a few lines yes I think that's absolutely fine I mean those small roles are are the hardest because you just have nothing to dig your teeth into so again you just have to sort of be present and try not to make too much out of it right so try not to make too much out of it we talked a little bit before about how a lot of casting directors will say oh this person did something completely different and how they got the role that's how they got the role and that seems a bit misleading in a way because as you don't want your actors to aim to do something different for different sakes so what kind of guidance do you have around I mean interpreting the role yeah I mean it's such a tricky thing because yeah how do you stand out but still you can't be arbitrary for arbitrary sake just to be different and you're not playing the scene but you can stretch it you can you know you can try to find new ways to come at it but you still you still have to you know play the reality of the scene I want to understand what the relationship is of these characters to each other but you know there's room to play within that but it can't just become bizarre or it can but I mean it might work I mean you know and when we were talking about this earlier too I mean with the wonderful and difficult thing about this industry is it's so subjective so what you know might float my boat isn't necessarily going to float other people's boats so you know having some sense of what you think the casting you know if you have a relationship with the casting director and you have some sense of what they respond to you know that can be helpful um right so you also just told me um that you have started seeing people back in the room um so can trying trying it's got to get productions that are actually here so we can have people so can you um sort of this is a really broad question and then maybe we'll narrow in just you know sort of post on post-COVID sort of COVID ever before COVID everybody was sending in self-tapes anyway but especially actors in the locals but once COVID hit everybody started self-taping so now post-COVID can you give us an idea of how you've seen things change over the last five years oh are we talking just about the industry because we don't have time for the rest of it um you know I think I think the the ideal the goal for so many of us is you know I the plus to the self-tapes is that it has leveled the playing field in a way people have gotten opportunities who wouldn't necessarily get them if you're only having person person in person sessions because there's just not enough time in the day so I think you know sort of the idea is uh that's kind of the pre-screen process um and then you do a you know callback over zoom uh and then you know maybe a final callback in the room um but we're doing you know some first time in the room uh it you know and some of that is also knowing the actors you know uh I will probably still do a pre-screen over uh through self-tape if it's someone I'm not as familiar with but that I I think you know some sort of hybrid is is the goal you know the hard part too is when production first left LA and and stuff was filming elsewhere and producers and directors had to get used to seeing actors on tape and that took them a while to get used to that and not being in the room and not being able to work with the actors now we've gotten to the other extreme where that's all the how they you know so many um producers and directors see auditions you know that we all and I I raise my hand here too have become guilty of what I call the swipe left mentality which is just who else who else who else instead of really Yvette I keep looking at you and I'm so excited you're here um um is you know is to really zero in and and really watch the audition and not just know there are you know so many other people you know you can look at or request or whatever to you know really zero in and look at the performance and even if it isn't perfect you know there are things in there the same way you do in the room someone comes in the room they don't nail that you've given them adjustment and you know you work with them but you see something there that's you know where you start and that still has to exist in the self tape and I think again I'm just as guilty of like yeah didn't quite you know or it's someone I'm not as familiar with so I you know I have to keep reminding myself to really take the time and and look for the performance in there it's an interesting conundrum because yes it's more opportunity but also for you it's so much more volume so I'm wondering when it is that pre-screen where you don't know people so well I mean is it just that if they don't nail it or appeal to you in some big way you're just going to move on you're not going to give a note because yeah I mean someone else nailed it yes I mean and again it depends on the size of the role you know um if it's a smaller role you know there just isn't there just isn't the time um but if you know if it's a significant part and um you know then then you will um but yeah I mean and that's the hard part too of not being in the room anymore is there are just so many actors especially you know young people coming up who I've never met and you just don't have the same connection and you don't you're not in sadly invested in the same way if you've never met somebody and so that is hard it's hard you know on our end and it's hard on their end um but you know when you've when you've been in the room with someone and you've gotten to give them an adjustment and you you know you can see what they can do you get a sense of them as a person you know because part of our job is also feeling like I can put this person on a set and know that they're gonna be able to deliver they're going to be able to roll with whatever personalities they may be dealing with on that set and you know that gets trickier when you've never met the person you're not going to sort of go to bat in the same way because you just you're just not sure yourself yeah um preparation so when when someone let's say is having a call back or a zoom call back um what kind of preparation do you expect people to do between the first audition and the second and do you want to see something different or just more of the same for different people how will people know that oh I always ask questions I mean to add that's you know have your agents and managers you know working for you but you know be you know we will we will try to give notes I mean to say if there's something different um or if the you know if they're different sides you know to give them some context the other thing that's become so hard is scripts are being shared less and less um so you guys are just like shooting in the dark and we're spending half the callback explaining what's going on in the scene and um but uh but you know ask questions if if you're not sure that you've got to advocate for yourself sometimes again we just get so busy we sort of lose track but um I you know I think if you get a call back generally people are looking you know they responded to what you did so trust what you did and um you know don't go crazy and you know change it up um but you know there may be things that yeah we we are gonna pass on that you need to think about or you know sometimes what happens a lot of times what happens in casting is um what we're looking for morphs as we're working on it we sort of start you know thinking the character is is this way and looking you know for care for people you know to fit this description and then as you start to hear it and the writer starts to hear it and he starts that you know it it will start to change a little bit and sometimes the writing doesn't always catch up to that so sometimes you're being asked to do things that the writing doesn't always support and that gets tricky so you know if you get a note and this the you know script isn't really supporting it you know again feel free to ask those questions because you know we understand it in our head but we forget that you guys aren't you know always fully caught up to that and so is it also a case-by-case basis whether or not you want actors to be word perfect or if you're okay with some improvisation yeah and again i think that's you know that's research you guys need to do you know there are you know certain writers of course who are known for being you know wanting absolutely word perfect and the pause where the comma is and things like that um and others you know who are much more open improv and again that's a question you can ask when you get you know the audition or the callback to say you know how much room do i have to play with it but you have to be prepared for you know either answer and um in terms of the the volume of tapes and the deadlines do you personally watch tapes on a rolling basis as and when they come in or do you wait until the deadline and then no generally as they roll in just you know to be able to kind of keep up with everything and then you know but but if i if i've watched somebody sort of very early on and they were kind of you know sort of stuck out in my head you know i will sort of circle back after i've watched more just as a yeah so there's no recency bias yeah yeah that's great um do you have like what are your top tips for zoom callbacks and for self-tapes you know you talked about good lighting good sound for self-tape but is there anything else that an actor can do to set themselves apart or show you that they're professional or prepared i mean one of the things um for zoom auditions if you have and again you need to double check this with the casting people but if you have someone who can read with you and not have to be have your reader be over zoom have the person in the room with you that can make a big difference especially if you're doing anything with some comic timing because nothing like a zoom load kill the comedy people um uh so you know and that's you know again something we've just sort of learned along the way not always you know again this is what's hard is you don't always have people available to you to read but um and and having a great reader if you can again someone that you sort of trust who's going to give you you know um what you need for the scene without drawing attention to themselves um and like i said going back to you know play the scene and and you know the look the plus to self-taping is you can set yourself up in the scene in a way that you can't do when you walk into the room you don't want to walk in with a bag full of props and you know some hair and makeup people and um you know so again this is me speaking but i you know put yourself in the scene give yourself some business to do give yourself some props if it'll help you sort of bring the the scene to life you don't want your production design to um outshine your work but um but you know but do set yourself up in the scene as best you can so you can again be sort of dropped in and be able to play the scene and not worried about the cameras right there you know if you're supposed to get up and leave the scene during the meals leave camera uh you know i'm like what the fuck just that person just you're like wow that's cool what are they doing what are they up to so i've never met an actor who doesn't love a prop um and i'm sure i don't need to remind you all that we have self-tape studios at the sag after foundation you can just go to the calendar and book time with our readers and you'll have great lighting and great sound and right um again great lighting and great sound is really key you would be amazed by some of the stuff we receive and great readers um chemistry reads you know those larger roles how important are chemistry reads and how can an actor prepare really to do their best work i mean you know that's tough because i mean sometimes we're doing chemistry reads over zoom you know which again isn't ideal but i mean but it's it's worked um again i you know you just you got to do all the same prep work you gotta you know you got to be specific about your choices but you can't be married to your reading does that make sense like you know you've got to be open you got to work off of the other person you gotta you know you gotta know your the your the work so well and again you know memorization helps but but just being so clear about what the beats are in the scene so that when you're working off of somebody and they're giving you something else like you have this roadmap and now you get to sort of take a little detour you know and play on the detour um but if you're not and again you'd be surprised by the number of people who just aren't prepared really just you know haven't you know or it's it's wanting to sort of play it safe you know and not the not not really making choices and so it just you kind of come away going maybe but you know i it's just so hard to tell and this sounds like such a cliche and i know i've said it in other settings but like i'd rather someone make a bold wrong choice than than kind of no choice but again can't be just arbitrary for the sake of you know being bold but yeah all makes perfect sense um finding new talent all of the new actors that you were talking about who are coming up um you know is there a way or especially if you're looking for kids or you know is there a way for people maybe who don't have representation um to audition for projects that you're casting yeah i mean in reality that it's hard i mean just because the volume of people who are represented is amazing to me every time i put out a breakdown i'm you know there seems to just be more and more managers and um uh no comment um but uh so you know it it is a volume game i mean certainly with you know kids we're we're always sort of looking um you know for resources outside of just agents uh you know doing theater um is great and uh even just you know student film so you have something on film that that we can see um but it's you know i'm not gonna pretend that you know we can see everybody who you know wants to audition um and then social media like do you ever i mean i probably am gonna lose a bunch of jobs this way but um i don't have tiktok i refuse to find talent on tiktok um i you know i mean that's you know well again i am not too no whatever um but i and which is not to say there aren't you know talented people who are you know being discovered that way i just i come from theater and i just am about actors and training and people who have decided this is actually a craft and have worked uh on their craft um so and you know how many followers somebody has as to whether they get cast i feel so fortunate that the projects i've worked on that has just not come into play i do think they're you know i think in the ya world and you know and some of those you know that does come into play when you're you know you're finding new faces and you're trying to get eyeballs to come and see your you know your show um you know that that can i play a part but um i feel very very fortunate that what i've done has really been about you know the talent that's great i want to see if we can do a quick sort of rapid fire round where i mentioned some of the shows that i'm sure we've all seen and love and um you tell me if there's a particular um actor or a role that was a challenge to cast something that you're particularly proud of that comes to mind when i mention the show gosh i'm so nervous about this because i've i've been known to overshare so it's just for the people in the room right all right manhattan oh manhattan was a that's a heartbreaker for me because it was a show that most people didn't see because half of los angeles didn't get wgn but um that was uh that that was a lot of new york theater people we ended up casting so that was incredibly fulfilling to me um and i would say uh you know that was uh my first first of three times casting rachel brosnahan so and that was and it was a period piece which was so cool i hadn't done too much of that and um but yeah i mean that was just really like so many actor actors and that was her first series lead was it not uh for her yeah she had done house of cards at that point yeah um all right so leading on from there mazel the marvelous mrs mazel i mean again i you know that was i you know i only did the pilot of that because they were going to be shooting in new york and i knew that going into it because amy wants very much to be uh hands-on with her casting which is great but um that was you know cast contingent on finding midge so um so yeah we were reading people and rachel was first person i thought of when i read the scripts and that was a bit of a battle just because she hadn't done comedy um but she's you know so smart i mean if i i do believe if you're smart enough you can ultimately find the comedy great all right so uh snowfall can i have to skip that one only because i didn't do the pilot so i came in and in the series so i don't want to pretend all right take credit for the dropout oh that's a good one too um oh what was the one on that one i mean the role of sunny um balwani i mean that was um and naveen who played the role uh i think i've shared this before but you know uh initially i kept saying you know his reps were great about pushing him and i was like he's no he's too attractive he's too good looking like sunny was just sort of an odd guy and i kept saying no and kept saying no and they kept pushing and so finally i was like fine fine we'll bring him in and he just you know crushed it of course and it was again a reminder that you know you can't put people into these categories and an actor is an actor and and especially an actor who's a good looking actor who's willing to not be good looking is you know is super cool um so i'm thinking of somebody who's who fit also fits that bill who was in station 11 do you have some favorite oh it was another heartbreaker too because i feel like not enough people watched it and it was such a beautiful if you guys have not seen that show please do me a favor you know i think it came out during covid it's about a you know a virus that wipes out most of the population so this is a little close to home at the time um and in fact we were shooting the first and third episode um at the time the first covid case uh came out in in chicago which is where they were shooting and i remember sending a note to the producers being life are fine line ha ha ha ha yeah cut to we shut down weeks later um but it's a really really beautiful piece that's actually about hope and healing and love and art and so please please watch it um i mean that probably for me um was casting um matilda lawler yes matilda young matilda um i had seen her do this play in new york where she had to sit and listen to a monologue that fenula flanagan did which was probably like a a three-minute monologue and when i saw the play it had probably been running for you know several months she was so alive listening to this monologue that she had heard a bazillion times at that point i couldn't take my eyes off of her um and then she you know she she taped initially and then she did a um chemistry read with him ash patel that like we just you know we were all crying and in tears and him ash was like uh you know yeah it was she's extraordinary thank you very much matilda lawler ladies and gentlemen all right all right are we good to keep going dying for sex i mean oh such a great show so many uncomfortable auditions um but talk about commitment man people went for it i i mean truly truly extraordinary jenny slate probably would be you know um and that was a little you know a little a little bit of a battle um just i mean everyone knows how extraordinary she is but you know about the being able to play the the drama and um again she did a chemistry read and just it was just unbelievable but also you know she was willing to fight for it you know she's an actor of a certain level that you know a lot of times it's it's people's reps that are you know sort of gatekeepers actors i think actors sometimes are more willing to fight for things and their reps are you know trying to maybe protect them but um but you know she she was like no i'm i'm going forward i want you know i want my shot i want to get in the room and that's amazing is there anything in that story that we should be unpicking about the agent casting director actor relationships i mean it you know it's a it's a tricky balance and again i understand you know reps wanting to you know protect actors or or sort of you know actors work so hard to get to a certain level that you hope you know then um means you don't have to go and and and fight in the same way you've had to for so much of your career um but you know the industry is changing and there's less opportunities and so i think you know um in at a time when offers were made you know more freely it's just not the case anymore and i think there are so many actors who want to and need to work that um if you know if somebody's not willing to read you know producers will move on to somebody who is yeah yeah that's really good advice that's good to know all right huge fan favorite the bear oh i mean again it's just so special um i mean i think in that case it would it would be eban i mean i i've just been such a huge fan of his for so long and um that was uh particularly satisfying yeah again you know putting people in roles that you you know haven't seen them do or unexpected or stretches them in a way i think you know again having come from theater you know i i grew up going to it and that's where i first started casting so this idea that actors you know i would see somebody do a shakespeare play and then i'd see him in a musical and then i'd see him and you know an edward albee play or something you know and i'm like same actor and so this idea that you know actors can do lots of different things but again i understand and i again i'm just as guilty of it of putting people in certain slots um and you have to just you know go back and again people who have trained who really you know have worked hard on their craft yeah it's wonderful um all right just a couple more and then we'll move on to the scene work um beef you did season two of beef yeah i mean that uh probably uh bill fickner uh again just have been such a huge fan for so long and i just think he's so interesting to watch and is always gonna make the weird choice but there there's a there's a there's a a perfect example though who's someone who can make the weird choice but it's still it's still true to the scene he's still playing the scene he's just gonna come at it in a way that um you don't expect in any way um and i he's i just cast him in a project coming out where he's going to play the physicist richard fineman and i'm just so fascinated to see what he does with that because again not what you would expect yeah what a contrast yeah when he walks up the stairs at the end there you're like what is he doing it's crazy and it's brilliant lucky we could all you know watch that as a cast victor in that i had a triple crown with fickner this year too um interesting um i may have to come back on that yeah i'm gonna do one more and then i'm gonna move on to some final thoughts but i'm presumed innocent maybe i have to say chase infinity um that was her first job before the big movie um and that's one of those you know situations where you know you get asked all the time as casting directors how do you know how do you know when someone's a star how do you know when somebody and she's just wanna i mean it she just jumped off the that was the self-tape initially and she just jumped off the screen and you know i've known her manager a long time and i called him i said you know look i don't know if this is gonna be the one she gets but like strap in because she is about to go on a journey and um and then she came back and read over zoom because she was in chicago she read over zoom with jake and just how she handled herself you know being on zoom with jake gyllenhaal in her you know second professional audition or something you know and just you just man you just knew you just knew it's so cool thank you so much genie for joining us and we're really excited to get into the scene well and i do just want to say in terms of social media i'm not on there much i'm trying very hard to not um because i never feel good after i get off um but uh and so i and i've i i am trying in my social media whatever my instagram is more sort of just either work promotion stuff which i hate doing but um or you know or personal anyway i if you if you try to friend me on instagram i'm i i i'm sort of not my thing so don't take it personally please taken note taken genie thank you so much for being here thank you
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